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posted by [personal profile] eftychia at 05:26am on 2006-11-11 under ,

"Like anal sex and BDSM, fisting is often mistakenly associated with the gay community or is considered a sex act too extreme to be appropriate for Christian couples. Not only are these views incorrect, but fisting actually has a scriptural precedent, as we will show. [...] Given the powerful symbolism of the fist, it is no surprise that couples who have partaken in the practice of fisting have described it as being a profoundly spiritual experience. On a symbolic and sexual level, a wife who is fisted by her husband has the experience of surrendering completely to the divine love and power of the Lord, as embodied by her partner's hand. The husband in turn has the experience of touching and caressing her inwardly, in such a deep and intimate manner as God touches our own souls with His grace." -- from Fisting and God's Will, on the Sex In Christ web site.

There are 14 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
 
posted by [identity profile] flaviarassen.livejournal.com at 01:28pm on 2006-11-11
If the self-interest isn't obvious enough, I call everyone's attention
to the fact that this guy (& you know darned well it's a guy who wrote
this) only meantions BEING fisted with a strong caveat. Please note that
I am not condemning the act, just the self-serving pretense that it's
G-d's Will (tm), rather than just his own desires. In fact, the very
idea that he has to cloak it as such proves that he thinks there's
something wrong with it.
 
posted by [identity profile] dglenn.livejournal.com at 11:21pm on 2006-11-14
While I agree that your hypothesis as to his motives (oh yeah, I also agree with your conclusion about the author's gender) is likely, in fairness I feel I should point out that he might not actually think there's anything wrong with it but still be aware that much of his audience does, and be trying to pitch it in terms that a particular audience will be more likely to accept. So he could be trying to convince himself or to convince others (or, of course, both).

But the gender asymmetry and (even more) the reasoning behind it bugged me too.
 
posted by [identity profile] flaviarassen.livejournal.com at 05:29am on 2006-11-15
I fully cop to not thinking about the nicest possible
explanation - thanks for the lesson in being a human being!
ext_432: (Default)
posted by [identity profile] zoethe.livejournal.com at 01:51pm on 2006-11-11
WTF?

I mean fisting's fine if that's what you're into. But this divinity layer? Dude.
 
posted by [identity profile] wouldyoueva.livejournal.com at 02:23pm on 2006-11-11
That is an amazing site. I particularly like the Biblical justification for threesomes. *He* can have two women but *she* can't have two men. Where's the fun in that?
 
posted by [identity profile] flaviarassen.livejournal.com at 04:48am on 2006-11-13
The same fun there is in making sure that she understands how
lucky she is to have him fist her, but that dhe'd better be darned
sure she knows who's in charge if she wants to fist him.
THAT kind of fun.
 
posted by [identity profile] amelia-g.livejournal.com at 05:00pm on 2006-11-11
Oh my.
 
posted by [identity profile] realinterrobang.livejournal.com at 06:27pm on 2006-11-11
Thus proving, once again, that you can use religion to justify anything.
 
posted by [identity profile] darwiniacat.livejournal.com at 08:28pm on 2006-11-11
Except, of course, if gay people do it! Then it's a sin!
 
posted by [identity profile] dglenn.livejournal.com at 10:47pm on 2006-11-14
This merely a demonstration, not a proof, that you can use religion to justify anything. The formal proof, however, should be obvious to any mathematician.

Note that this does not mean that you can use any religion to justify anything -- one should be able to construct a religion for which that is not the case. ("∃ religion R | (∀ p | Rp)" is true, as is the very different "∀ p | (∃ R | Rp)", but "∀ R | (∀ p | Rp)" is (I think) false. That is, ∃ R | (∃ p | R does not imply p).) But, of course, that would then spark heated argument over whether said religion were technically a religion.

I shall refrain from making any claims or guesses as to whether there is any known, existing religion about which one can say that it is not possible to justify anything/everything using it. I'll merely note that the religions that come quickly to mind can be shown to be useable to justify anything. Fortunately the path required to get from the axioms articles of faith to some conclusions is convoluted enough to raise red flags even for believers. Unfortunately smooth-talkers can sometimes obscure that feature, and some rather unfortunate conclusions can be reached via less tortured reasoning than that. I mean, there's a "common sense" test that applies where formal logic doesn't, but the "common sense" test ain't as reliable as one would hope. But if you want to try to use logic instead, well as soon as you hit the first instance of "p ∧ !p", it's game over.

Huh. Why isn't there a slashed double-right-arrow HTML entity for "does not imply"?
 
posted by [identity profile] anniemal.livejournal.com at 08:38am on 2006-11-12
I'll do it if you wish. Further discussion is something not for the public.
 
posted by [identity profile] dptwisted.livejournal.com at 01:29pm on 2006-11-13
Much is made clear! Bush is just touching the public with God's grace!
 
posted by [identity profile] skreidle.livejournal.com at 11:11pm on 2006-11-13
Religious symbolism entirely aside, I've heard from people who partake in "fisting"--a misnomer, since no closed fist is involved, more of a rolled flat palm--and even seen it done (at the Dark Odyssey conference a couple years ago), and they maintain that it is an intensely deep, intimate, spiritual form of contact. (They made no mention whatsoever of God analogues, go figure.)
 
posted by [identity profile] lysystratae.livejournal.com at 04:26am on 2006-11-15
BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA....

That's not spiritual, that's painful! lol... the only thing spiritual about it was the halo the last guy that tried to do it to me was seeing after I clocked him (one more reason to always ask first)

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