eftychia: Me in kilt and poofy shirt, facing away, playing acoustic guitar behind head (Default)
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posted by [personal profile] eftychia at 05:26am on 2007-09-21

"It's astonishing how some people think we are supposed to have 'rulers' in a free country, rather than elected representatives who answer to our authority.

"I think there is a percentage of the public who genuinely want to be stomped on. They wish for a charismatic ruler---yes, a ruler---to march in, kick our asses until we stop whining, and then kick everyone else's asses while we swoon at the exercise of raw power.

"I wonder if the concept of a Messiah is just hard-coded into human nature, expressing itself in major religions , folklore, as well as the political desire for a ruler that takes charge like this."

-- Caj, 2007-08-21

[Compare this to yesterday's QotD, from [info] maugorn, regarding absolutist, 'received wisdom' morality, and free will.]

There are 7 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
 
posted by [identity profile] smallship1.livejournal.com at 09:33am on 2007-09-21
I think Caj is easily astonished.
 
posted by [identity profile] silmaril.livejournal.com at 01:38pm on 2007-09-21
Related, from Pratchett, Feet of Clay:

"It seemed to be a chronic disease. It was as if even the most intelligent person had this little blank spot in their heads where someone had written: "Kings. What a good idea." Whoever had created humanity had left in a major design flaw. It was its tendency to bend at the knees."

The reason? I have started to think that it is easier that way for people. Bah.
 
posted by (anonymous) at 02:29pm on 2007-09-21
All the elders of Israel gathered themselves together and came to Shmuel (Samuel, the prophet)to Rama, and said to him,..."Now make us a king to judge us like all the other nations." But the thing displeased Shmuel... and Shmuel prayed to God. And God said to Shmuel, "... They have not rejected you, they have rejected Me, that I should not reign over them...Now you must hearken to their voice; nevertheless you should warn them and relate to them the customary practice of the king that shall reign over them." And Shmuel told all the the words of the Lord to the people that asked of him a king....Nevertheless, the people refused to obey the voice of Shmuel; and they said, "No, but we will have a king over us; that we may be like all the nations..." I Samuel 8:4-22

Just goes to show, some things don't change.
 
posted by [identity profile] scooterbird.livejournal.com at 03:12pm on 2007-09-21
It's common sense, really. How many people do you know who can adeptly govern themselves?
siderea: (Default)
posted by [personal profile] siderea at 04:56pm on 2007-09-21
Um, duh. The word you are all looking for is father!

Or maybe it's mother.

That Freud dude was on to something.
 
posted by [identity profile] maugorn.livejournal.com at 05:02pm on 2007-09-21
As the commenter quoted in yesterday, here's my perspective on rulers vs leaders.

Lots of people think that they do want rulers and that ruling and leading are congruent. Sadly, most of them are simply unaware of the subtle difference. And again, it comes down to abdicating responsibility. Responsibility brings consequences which, especially when unpleasant consequences are in the offing, they wish to avoid.

In my book, there is no form of governance that is better than the others.
All systems of "<>ocracy" can work, and all of them sometimes/often don't.
It all comes down to whether the bottom line is treating those in your charge well. If you view leadership as a responsibility and a trust, and strive to do well and to be trustworthy, then your <>ocracy will thrive.
If you view it as having set up or played the game so that your class is on top of a pecking order and rationalise abuse as your right or some sort of twisted "necessity", then your system will fail or be overthrown. And if you're overthrown by those who are more interested in simply getting their way than doing what's right, then it's just
"Meet the new boss, same as the old boss"

Human evolution DOES point to alot of potential for growing out of the need for a "boss". But alas, we ain't there in consensus yet.
 
posted by [identity profile] dptwisted.livejournal.com at 10:45pm on 2007-09-21
My theory is that it's evolutionary in nature (<-- inadvertant pun, sorry). We're not that far off (in evolutionary terms) from the monkeys with their pack mentality, which hard-codes for alphas and betas. Humans naturally fall into hierarchical societies. Will we ever overcome that? Should we ever overcome that? Ask me in a few million years and it'll be obvious.

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