eftychia: Me in kilt and poofy shirt, facing away, playing acoustic guitar behind head (Default)
Add MemoryShare This Entry
posted by [personal profile] eftychia at 03:43am on 2005-03-17

Some folks like links, especially links in journal entries, to automatically open in a new window when clicked. I really don't, because when I want a link to open in a new window, I explicitly tell the computer that by means of right-click, shift-click, command-click, control-shift-click, command-shift-click, or click-and-hold, depending on the hardware, OS, and browser I'm using, and whether I want the new window on top or in the background. If I simply left-click (or on a Mac, just-plain-click) on a link, it means I explicitly want -- and darned well expect, since it's the default behaviour -- that the destination will be opened in the current window, replacing the page I'd just been looking at. (Or that something expected and sensible will happen with frames, if I'm viewing a page that uses frames.)

That said, I understand why some other users prefer to have links open in a new window, even if my preference is that the default behaviour not be messed with. And I think I understand a bunch of the reasons some web designers want links to open in new windows, even if it usually annoys me. (I'm assuming that most LJ users who use this feature in their journal entries prefer that behaviour as users and are doing so as a courtesy to their readers who they expect to have the same preference. I know that's the motivation for at least some of them.)

But I've got a complaint that goes a smidgen farther than my personal preference to remain in control of the user interface and the operation of my tools.

Sometimes it actually breaks things (though perhaps it requires a coding error to do so).

Twice in the past three days I have been surprised by a link that appeared to do nothing when I clicked it other than to change from the "unvisited" colour to the "been there" colour. (In at least one case, it was in somebody's journal; the other I don't recall what site I was looking at.) No new page loading in that window, no new window suddeny opeing, nuffin' ...

Until I was going through my stack of previously opened windows containing pages I wanted to come back to before closing, and found that one of them had been overwritten by the page I'd been trying to get to when I clicked on the apparently-no-op link. **growl**

The one that I checked the source code of (I'd closed the other one before figuring out what it had done) used target="_new" instead of what I had expected to see, target="blank" so I'm guessing that one of my already open windows just happened to be 'named' _new for some reason? I was able to spot which window had been overwritten and use the back button to return to the page I wasn't finished yet, because at that moment there were no other windows whose titles were blue (Opera uses colour to indicate windows that have not been selected since the pages displayed in them finished rendering), but that's an unusual condition for my desktop, since I use "open in background" as often as I do.

I don't like having unexpected behaviour messing with windows that the site I'm viewing didn't create. Actually, I don't like having unexpected behaviour screw up what I'm trying to do in windows that are tied to that site, either. Some time back I had a problem with Yahoo Groups or Yahoo Clubs (I don't remember which; it was during the time both were in use). Since I'm on a slow connection, I try to interleave downloading and reading -- pop open several windows for pages to trickle into while I'm reading the first one, rather than twiddling my thumbs waiting for a page to render, reading it, then twiddling my thumbs waiting for the next one. So I tried to open a bunch of messages from a few different clubs in separate windows, planning to then move through the stack of windows closing each as I finished reading it. On most sites, this works. But in Yahoo Clubs, sometimes when I said "open in background" I got a new blank window while the message I'd asked for in that window got loaded into some other already-open window, overwriting a message I hadn't gotten around to reading yet. Which was enough of a frustration that I hardly ever even bother with the Yahoo Clubs/Groups any more.

So please, if you're going to get fancy with the target clause, don't get too fancy, make sure you get it right, and don't assume I'm going to use my browser exactly the same way you do. So that if you surprise me it's only a smallish surprise. As much as I'd like folks to just let the default thing happen, I know I'm not going to change the minds of the folks who really prefer having new windows pop up ... as a compromise, I'd appreciate a bit of warning, like "(opens in new window)" after the links that do that, but I'll mostly settle for just not having them do really strange stuff, load where I can't find them quickly (I may have as fifty or sixty open windows to look through) or overwrite pages I wasn't finished with yet (i.e. any window already open, 'cause if I were finished with that page for now, I would've closed the window).

Basically, please don't break my UI. Thanks.

There are 11 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
geekosaur: orange tabby with head canted 90 degrees, giving impression of "maybe it'll make more sense if I look at it this way?" (Default)
posted by [personal profile] geekosaur at 01:13pm on 2005-03-17
``target="_new"'' sounds like Netscape 3/4, which handled targets prefixed with underscores specially but treated all others as literals (although they may have finally added things like "blank" eventually). "Nice" to see that someone got the swift idea of mishandling backward compatibility....
 
posted by [identity profile] blueeowyn.livejournal.com at 03:30pm on 2005-03-17
I use Netscape 4.79 and 'target="blank"' is how I do the 'open this link as a new window' command.(
geekosaur: orange tabby with head canted 90 degrees, giving impression of "maybe it'll make more sense if I look at it this way?" (Default)
posted by [personal profile] geekosaur at 05:14pm on 2005-03-17
As I said... they added it. Actually I think _new may have been a netscape3-ism, but some of us who're older than dirt :> still have it wired into our fingers. (Although I wasn't whoever did it to [livejournal.com profile] dglenn; I agree that in general it's a bad idea to force opening new windows.)
ckd: small blue foam shark (Default)
posted by [personal profile] ckd at 02:10pm on 2005-03-17
For me, it's worse. RSI means using the Palm browser more, and it doesn't support pop ups at ALL. If you make your link open in a new window I cannot follow it.

So folks, please don't do that.
 
posted by [identity profile] blueeowyn.livejournal.com at 03:29pm on 2005-03-17
So, in your experience a 'target="blank"' command is equivalent to a pop-up?r
ckd: small blue foam shark (Default)
posted by [personal profile] ckd at 06:06pm on 2005-03-17
To this browser it is.
 
posted by [identity profile] blueeowyn.livejournal.com at 09:17pm on 2005-03-20
Huh, for some reason I thought that the new window would only open if you clicked the link (as opposed to pop-ups that open in the background whether or not you clicked anything on the screen).
ckd: small blue foam shark (Default)
posted by [personal profile] ckd at 01:56am on 2005-03-21
It's a PDA. It has nowhere to put a new window. It does do frames, so it tries to handle target attributes on links. If I select a link that tries to open in a new window, I get the error "This browser does not support pop-up windows".
 
posted by [identity profile] blueeowyn.livejournal.com at 03:31pm on 2005-03-17
I know that my default 'target="blank"' annoys you and I do feel bad about it but at least if the new window takes for ever to load (or worse is likely to torpedo the browser you are using) you can keep reading (and I usually put the URL in so that you can go to it later if you wish).c
 
posted by [identity profile] mammasteed.livejournal.com at 01:30am on 2005-03-18
For whatever it's worth, yeah, I've experienced windows loading into an already-open window instead of a new one too. I'm not interested in *why* that happens (I refuse to be a techie-geek!), but I definitely agree with you that it's very annoying.
 
posted by [identity profile] silmaril.livejournal.com at 06:34pm on 2005-03-18
There's not enough "Amen" in the world. My display speed is inversely proprtional to the number of windows I have, plus I love tabbed browsing, and try to keep things in one window as much as I can, since that blessed feature lets me do that. Explicitly hardcoding to open in new window is taking away my choice of how I arrange my browsing; don't take options away from me kplzthx.

And yes, at least put a warning so that I can copy-paste link URL if I want to.

Links

January

SunMonTueWedThuFriSat
1 2 3 4 5 6 7
8 9 10 11 12 13 14
15 16 17 18 19 20 21
22 23 24
 
25
 
26
 
27
 
28
 
29
 
30
 
31